Chevy Spark EV Forum
http://www.mychevysparkev.com/forum/

Bolt!
http://www.mychevysparkev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=4421
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Author:  cwerdna [ Wed Jan 20, 2016 12:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

MrDRMorgan wrote:
Even Nissan has only sold 78,510 nationwide in the same period. Nissan did build an infrastructure but where? Through their dealer network?

Unfortunately, many/most are installed at their dealers. And, often they're inaccessible after hours and when they were free, dealer usage policies were VERY YMMV.

There has been some other action and there was also http://www.bmwblog.com/2015/12/21/bmw-a ... -charging/, more recently.
MrDRMorgan wrote:
Fortunately, NRG EVgo seems to be moving forward on their own to build out a nice DCFC network.

The NRG EVgo DC FCs in California are due to a settlement w/the CPUC. See viewtopic.php?p=7523#p7523. The image at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?t=15927 is dead but the YouTube video w/map still works.
nikwax wrote:
As for GM, I don't think they owe us EVSEs any more than they owe us gas stations. Though GM would suck less if they at least had DCFC at their dealers. But not even BMW or VM is doing that.

The 24 kW http://www.bmwicharging.com/BMWiDCFastCharger is "BMW subsidized price for BMW Centers and authorized partners." Some BMW dealers have them. http://insideevs.com/crevier-bmw-instal ... l-2-evses/ installed 4 over a year ago. Some Kia dealers have been installed dual-standard DC FCs even though they only sell a plug-in vehicle w/CHAdeMO.

There's also this involving BMW, VW and Chargepoint: https://transportevolved.com/2015/01/22 ... coast-u-s/.

Author:  MrDRMorgan [ Wed Jan 20, 2016 8:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

Quote:
cwercna: The NRG EVgo DC FCs in California are due to a settlement w/the CPUC. See viewtopic.php?p=7523#p7523. The image at http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?t=15927 is dead but the YouTube video w/map still works.

Thanks. I was aware of NRG's settlement with the CPUC. I make heavy use of NRG EVgo's DCFC stations when I can but their billing system needs serious improvement and it is very difficult to get any usage information out of them. Compare that to Greenlots. Greenlots posts your usage information as soon as you disconnect from the charger and it is immediately available to view on their mobile APP.

I would like to see the EV charging infrastructure road map that shows how the State of California plans to meet the usage demand of the 1.5 million ZEVs Governor Brown wants on California's roads by 2025. In SB-350, the California utilities are tasked with the electrification of the transportation system. However, if the Idaho National Laboratory report I mentioned earlier is what the utilities will follow, then most of the charging infrastructure will be found at home and at work with DCFC stations located at charging "hot spots" To me, this does not bid well for long distance EV driving needs.

As I read PlugShare comments, I am now starting to see comments about charger access delays due to having to wait for a spot, poor charging "etiquette", and many other gripes. What is it going to happen when the number of ZEVs on the road increases dramatically? I did find one charging bright spot. I am starting to see NRG EVgo locations with two or more combo stations. One in Fremont, CA has 4! In Manteca where I live, we have at least 10 Spark EVs running around town but we do not have a single L2 or DCFC public charging location. We do, however, have a Tesla charging station and it has 8 charging locations!

Author:  SparkevBlogspot [ Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

MrDRMorgan wrote:
As I read PlugShare comments, I am now starting to see comments about charger access delays due to having to wait for a spot, poor charging "etiquette", and many other gripes. What is it going to happen when the number of ZEVs on the road increases dramatically?

Most of the wait is due to Leaf (and some BMW i3) getting free charge. They get 2 years of free 30 minutes charging, so they use DCFC full 30 minutes. Some slow charging Leaf even plug in for second (or third) 30 minute session, something that's not possible with SparkEV. Many even skip charging at home (costs money) and use DCFC (free). I've seen many use DCFC even when they don't need it. Without free charging, I estimate 80% reduction in waiting and eliminate bad etiquette.

Just the other day, a lady was starting i3 DCFC with 70% in battery. Since I was next in line, I commented that she'll be quick. Her response? She wanted all 30 minutes, because it's free! When I said she doesn't need 30 minutes, but only 5 minutes (or less) for 80%, and that I only need 10 minutes to get over the hill to get home, she was gracious enough to let me go ahead for 10 minutes, but if I got there 2 minutes later after she'd gone to market, I'd be waiting full 30 minutes just to get over the hill to get home.

From my encounters, BMW i3 drivers are far more gracious than Leaf drivers. Many leaf drivers could care less that they're charging at 2kW using 50kW dual head charger blocking CCS from charging when perfectly working Chademo charger was sitting empty when they first pulled in.

http://sparkev.blogspot.com/2015/10/jer ... eafed.html

They have no idea how slowly Leaf charges. I try to educate them with this blog post.

http://sparkev.blogspot.com/2015/10/lov ... users.html

Conversely, it seems many SparkEV drivers have no idea how quickly SparkEV charges, something that we should be very proud of for not making others wait (or wait as long).

http://sparkev.blogspot.com/2015/12/spa ... world.html

Author:  nozferatu [ Sun Jan 31, 2016 8:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

cwerdna wrote:
Nope, has nothing to do w/how much I like or don't like GM. Just look at their actions that I've already talked about over and over.


No actually I do think you don't like GM and that's fine. But what makes you think it's OK for Nissan to dictate everyone's charging standard and leave it up to them? Uh...no thanks to a monopoly. Look at the actions of ALL manufacturers...they are all jostling their own positions in this game and rightly so...that's how improvements occur and how technology development rates increase...through competition. What you're proposing is taking us backwards.

As far as Tesla goes, Tesla is a premium car company that charges an arm and leg for a high range EV luxury car. Their bread and butter are EVs...their only models are EVs...so yea...a company dedicated ONLY to EVs should offer their own charging practices. And they did so because A) they wanted to keep the entire tech in-house at first and B) they realized they couldn't make a high range EV with low current charging systems. No one would would wait 10 hours for their Tesla to charge while on a 300 mile road trip.

Maybe Tesla should have listened to your advice and stuck with CHAdeMO yes?

Author:  cwerdna [ Mon Sep 12, 2016 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

nozferatu wrote:
cwerdna wrote:
Nope, has nothing to do w/how much I like or don't like GM. Just look at their actions that I've already talked about over and over.


As far as Tesla goes, Tesla is a premium car company that charges an arm and leg for a high range EV luxury car. ...
Maybe Tesla should have listened to your advice and stuck with CHAdeMO yes?

No, but as I've said many times already, Tesla actually put wood behind their arrow. I may not like the fact that they came up with an additional "standard", but at least they're damned serious about it and have a TON of infrastructure properly deployed unlike GM who won't fund it (http://www.greencarreports.com/news/110 ... vy-bolt-ev, which I posted on page 1 of this thread). And, their standard is definitely better than CHAdeMO.

Maybe GM will come around, someday?

But hey... it "helps" that Tesla is far outspending their revenue, to the tune of $2.5 billion in accumulated net losses so far.

Back to the Bolt, multiple media sources are reporting the Chevy Bolt has 238 mile range on the EPA test. Wow!

http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1106042_2017-chevy-bolt-ev-electric-car-238-mile-epa-range-rating-119-mpge-combined
http://www.autoblog.com/2016/09/13/chevy-bolt-ev-238-mile-range/

Assuming there wasn't some error in conducting the test (I'd assume there's no way GM would want to cheat on this since they'd probably get found out fairly quickly), this is a very impressive number. If it turns out to be reasonably reliable, most of the other BEVs will really need to up their game or face sharply tanking sales.

Author:  SparkieVee [ Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

If anyone is in the Santa Monica area, their Alt Car Expo has a Bolt on display. Sadly it is locked, but at least it's not behind ropes so you can stick your nose right up to the glass. It will be there 10-5 on Saturday, 9/17. You can also look at and drive most of the currently available EVs. http://www.altcarexpo.com/

After seeing it my wife decided that instead of another Spark when our lease is up in two weeks, we're waiting for the Bolt.

Author:  Leafless [ Mon Sep 19, 2016 6:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

SparkieVee wrote:
If anyone is in the Santa Monica area, their Alt Car Expo has a Bolt on display. Sadly it is locked, but at least it's not behind ropes so you can stick your nose right up to the glass. It will be there 10-5 on Saturday, 9/17. You can also look at and drive most of the currently available EVs. http://www.altcarexpo.com/

After seeing it my wife decided that instead of another Spark when our lease is up in two weeks, we're waiting for the Bolt.


Right... the Bolt was on display at Exposition Park in L.A. (near the Coliseum) on September 11. Very nice package. I can see one in our future garage, parked next to the Spark EV. Spark for local driving; Bolt for the longer local driving; and we will keep our relatively low mileage Honda Pilot for those longer trips where interim charging is not a practical option.

Author:  cwerdna [ Tue Sep 20, 2016 11:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

http://www.chevrolet.com/bolt-ev-electric-vehicle.html now confirms a starting MSRP of $37,495. http://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/en/ ... icing.html says that includes destination charge.

http://www.chevrolet.com/content/dam/Ch ... 081016.pdf has the trim level comparison.

I'm surprised there's been so little chatter about the car here. http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... &start=580 has had about 25 pages of chatter between Feb 2016 posts and now vs. the crickets here.

Author:  SparkevBlogspot [ Wed Sep 21, 2016 5:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

cwerdna wrote:
I'm surprised there's been so little chatter about the car here. http://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.p ... &start=580 has had about 25 pages of chatter between Feb 2016 posts and now vs. the crickets here.

I think it's due to difference in demographics. Leaf is 5 seat and cost about $28K after tax credit. If extra $2K triples the range, it is something to get very excited about. Given that Leaf is lousy in performance and lousy in battery, Bolt offers whole lot more bang for the buck.

SparkEV is $18K post tax credit, and it's a different class. Sure, longer range and bit better performance would be nice, but given how SparkEV wants to shred the tires on acceleration already, it's probably adequate for most. $12K could buy whole lot of stuff, including a used gasser SUV to use for longer trips. And the battery is pretty damn fine, maybe even better than Bolt.

Speaking of, I wish Chevy offered smaller battery Bolt for lower cost. At 30 kWh for $22K post tax credit, it'd kill many gas cars in price range, especially the Prius, Ioniq (heard it's a dog in performance like Leaf), maybe even some Tesla 3. Then SparkEV driver might get bit more excited.

Author:  MrDRMorgan [ Wed Sep 21, 2016 11:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolt!

As a very satisfied Spark EV driver, I just do not see what the Bolt, or any other BEV, can offer that would cause me to switch. A Spark EV with the quick-charge option, like my 2015 Spark EV, can easily meet 85-90% of my local driving needs. I have even ventured out as far as 150 miles away from home without any problem by using the available quick-chargers. If I need to drive even longer distances, I can either use my 17 year-old pickup truck or rent a car. Even my 2014 Spark EV, without the quick-charge option, has not caused me any range concerns. I learned the car's limits and how to work with them and I am constantly getting full-charge range values of 103-110 miles. As more and more Spark EVs come off of lease, I believe there are going to be many great deals available. I might even snap one up.

My biggest concern has nothing to do with EVs. Instead, I am greatly concerned by the inconsiderate attitude of some ICE, PHEV and PEV idiot drivers. These idiots seem to think the quick-charge parking spots are theirs to park in as they please and for as long as they want. Others fake charging by hooking up but not charging just to get the parking spot. There seems to be no consideration for those drivers who have a real need to gain access to the chargers in order to charge their EV and complete their trip. Even when parking restrictions are clearly posted, these idiots ignore the law. Unless this is corrected quickly, the additional EVs coming into public use will only make the charger access problem worse.

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