Dealer discourages me from DCFC !

Very strange conversation with a dealer in CA. moments ago about the DCFC option on a used 2014. I was told I really don't need the DCFC, I'd probably never need to use it. I tried to explain that I plan to keep the car for 10 years or more and in a couple of years there will likely be many DCFC's in my area. I live in CT and there are only a few in our state at the moment. This "knowledgeable" person (not a salesman either) told me that all 7 of their 2014's are pre-DCFC option, BUT the vin's are in the 500,000 and up group. Now that I think of it, even the Carfax shows time of 1st purchase in mid 2014.
What the hell is it about this feature that's so hard to understand? Very frustrated, I ended our conversation abruptly but as politely as I could. Enlighten me about the car buying process if you wish. I've always bought from private sellers up til now. Also, if I'm wrong about something here, please let me know that as well.

David

Dealers' time span is "right now." They want to sell you a car that they have in stock right now. Period. Whatever they have in stock, that's what you need. If they don't have it, you don't need it. It's not fact based, it's money based.


Sounds like you know what you want. Hang in there, it will be available.

Thanks, nik. I know your right. It's just frustrating to get gibberish while trying to hold an intelligent conversation. I may go to Maryland Friday just to look around and see a Spark EV in the flesh.

David

The only way anyone could even consider not having DCFC is if they never want to take a long distance trip (I drove 300 miles over the weekend and Fast charged twice), if the car had a 6.6 kw built in charger, or if they are getting a crazy $139/mo 0 down lease deal on a new one. Since it doesn't have 6.6 kw, and one dealer told me they would never do $139/0, I wouldn't do it. DCFC is FANTASTIC!!!

Car Salesmen....

Do you know how to tell when they are lying and spouting BS?

Their lips are moving. :lol:

Know what you want and shop around using email.
Avoid the hassle and frustration of dealing with that lot.

Mark C, you are right except that even 6.6 Kw takes nearly 3 hours for for a full charge (6.6 x 3 = 19.8). I keep seeing complaints about the Spark not having 6.6 Kw available but to me there's little benefit waiting "only 3 hours" vs 7 hours. Get it up to 15 Kw or more and I start seeing a real benefit. BUT, 15 Kw @ 240v = 62 amps. That would likely be 4-6 awg cable. Even that is over a hour, but at least that time = dinner at a restaurant.
I just surprised another dealer over the phone. He put me on hold, came back and said: "As a matter of fact it DOES have the DC fast charge provisions!" (< 2,000 miles, $15,999!!!) Now THAT'S what I'm lookin' for. Now just waitin' on the money.

David.

Yesterday I drove up to Sacramento (65 miles) to work with members of the Sacramento Electric Vehicle Association in getting the EV message out to SMUD (Sacramento Municipal Utility District) employees at SMUD's employee appreciation day. There was great interest in EVs by the SMUD employees. While there I charged my 2015 Spark EV at the SMUD DCFC station (Greenlots). At the end of the day I drove back to Salida - 10 miles South of where I live - and charged up at an NRG EVgo DCFC station located at the Vineyard 76 Station in Salida. Then I went back home for a total of 150 miles of fun EV driving without any concern for "range anxiety". Don't need a DCFC option??? You do if you want to drive distances like I did yesterday. Around town, DCFC is not needed - just an L2 charger at home. Obviously, DCFC charging stations have to be available in locations you can access.

For me the dealer only had DCFC cars on the lot so he was telling me how important it was and how many stations there were available. I tried to tell him all those stations were not compatible with the spark and there were no compatible DCFC locations within 200 miles of us but he wouldn't concede that. I would have been happy leasing a car without DCFC since I think the number of times I will use it is pretty small, given the network and how I use the car, but since he gave me a decent price I wasn't going to insist on not having it.

What state are you in Homer?

dangerHV said:

I may go to Maryland Friday just to look around and see a Spark EV in the flesh.

David

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David,
If you do decide to come down to Maryland, Win Kelly Chevrolet in Columbia is probably your closest dealer for a test drive. From what I can see, no dealers in Baltimore are carrying the Spark - only those around Washington and one in Frederick.

Good luck!

dangerHV said:

What state are you in Homer?

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MD. At the time I leased there were no stations anywhere within the triangle described by Richmond VA, Pittsburgh PA, and NYC. I think there may now be one or two stations, with more scheduled to come on line, but it's still not clear to me that I'll find much use out of it. I'd probably prefer to rent a car for a roadtrip (esp. given some of the problems people report of chargers not working etc.).

dangerHV said:

Mark C, you are right except that even 6.6 Kw takes nearly 3 hours for for a full charge (6.6 x 3 = 19.8). I keep seeing complaints about the Spark not having 6.6 Kw available but to me there's little benefit waiting "only 3 hours" vs 7 hours.
David.

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I'm agreeing wth you. DCFC, very useful. 6.6Kw charger, no, no value at all to me, why would I pay for that? With a 240 volt charger, I've no problem charging the car over night, usually charges in a few hours.


Now if we could just get a network of DCFC's every 50 miles along travel routes, locally say the I5 corridor and out to the coast, I could take the car anywhere. 20 minutes to top off is fine with me.

Hi Homer, i see 3 DCFC chargers in MD on Plugshare. That's not enough. I happen to be lucky that there's one about 5-6 miles from where I live, at an upscale apartment complex. Hopefully they'll keep it up and operating reliably.
I can easily get to every part of CT on a single charge, but getting home is another story. I'd like to go fishing in the rural northwest corner, but would need to charge to make it home. Well, we'll have to wait and see.

David

Many more DCFC units are coming to MD. Royal Farms won a grant for 15 of them. Also, a unit was recently installed in Baltimore City, but is not live yet. I've used the ones in Camp Springs and by BWI airport.

http://pluginsites.org/sae-combo-chademo-at-royal-farms-in-urbana-md/

Joppa, MD has been delayed.

P.S.: I'm just saying, even at $139/0, I would not consider the 3.3kw Spark w/ no DCFC. I might consider it at this price if it had 6.6kw (but it wasn't an issue for me as I got the DCFC option). We should all hope they do something dramatic with the Bolt, besides DCFC, like supporting up to 75 amp/16-18kw, some V2G stuff, etc.

mczajka said:

...something dramatic with the Bolt, besides DCFC, like supporting up to 75 amp/16-18kw...

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Many existing homes can't support that.

NORTON said:

mczajka said:

...something dramatic with the Bolt, besides DCFC, like supporting up to 75 amp/16-18kw...

Click to expand...

Many existing homes can't support that.

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I don't think it would be for home, but for high power level two stations on commercial property. The Canadian Sun Country now makes 100amp level two chargers:

http://suncountryhighway.com/en/Item/ChargerStore#!/SCH100-EV-Charger/p/43196272/category=10658153

At this point, Sun Country has made a gigantic investment in high power level two charging across Canada, with the hopes that other (non-Tesla) auto companies will install high powered on board chargers in their cars. Will the Bolt have a 20kW option? What about the other manufactures? I'm guessing the DC fast charger option is cheaper for the auto manufactures than the high power onboard solution. In the end, we'll all have to pay for it, whether it be the higher cost of the car, or higher cost to charge at stations.

mczajka said:

Many more DCFC units are coming to MD. Royal Farms won a grant for 15 of them. Also, a unit was recently installed in Baltimore City, but is not live yet. I've used the ones in Camp Springs and by BWI airport.

http://pluginsites.org/sae-combo-chademo-at-royal-farms-in-urbana-md/

Joppa, MD has been delayed.

P.S.: I'm just saying, even at $139/0, I would not consider the 3.3kw Spark w/ no DCFC. I might consider it at this price if it had 6.6kw (but it wasn't an issue for me as I got the DCFC option). We should all hope they do something dramatic with the Bolt, besides DCFC, like supporting up to 75 amp/16-18kw, some V2G stuff, etc.

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And from my perspective, if you wouldn't be willing to lease the car without DCFC, I'm not sure why the fact that by the end of the three year lease there might be 10-20 stations spread over the entire metro area would make you comfortable buying the car.

I know BMW has talked about having a network of fast chargers running from DC to Boston but really, even *if* they accomplish that it doesn't seem like I'm going to want to drive to Connecticut in 70 mile increments separated by charging times (assuming the charger is working and not occupied).

I'm not trying to start an argument, just to suggest that it's perfectly possible to get a lot of use out of the car for local trips or overnight trips without a DCFC or a 6.6kw charger, and for the immediate future (i.e. the length of a 3 year lease) it's not clear to me that a DCFC is going to make it possible to use the car for long range roadtrips (except in pretty limited circumstances).

Come on up to Connecticut. We may be small, but we've got...I mean just think of all the.....hold your horses!, I'll think of something we're known for............Got it! We have the highest cost of living and tax burden anywhere in the country!!! (i think, maybe 2nd) I knew we were famous for something.
I'm not sure what was directed at who in the last few posts, but for me, I'll be buying the Spark outright. I'm taking a ride down to Miller tomorrow early morning just to see the little monsters in person. It will be a fun trip, around 7 or 8 hours each way. Good thing I love to drive. Just gimme an excuse.

David

dangerHV said:

I'll be buying the Spark outright. I'm taking a ride down to Miller tomorrow early morning just to see the little monsters in person. It will be a fun trip, around 7 or 8 hours each way. Good thing I love to drive. Just gimme an excuse.

David

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Cool! I didn't know anyone was selling 2014 CA cars here in MD. I have a friend who wants one but lives in the District. Thanks for the tip!

dangerHV said:

Come on up to Connecticut. We may be small, but we've got...I mean just think of all the.....hold your horses!, I'll think of something we're known for............Got it! We have the highest cost of living and tax burden anywhere in the country!!! (i think, maybe 2nd) I knew we were famous for something.
I'm not sure what was directed at who in the last few posts, but for me, I'll be buying the Spark outright. I'm taking a ride down to Miller tomorrow early morning just to see the little monsters in person. It will be a fun trip, around 7 or 8 hours each way. Good thing I love to drive. Just gimme an excuse.

David

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To see if you need DCQC, or just want it, you might want to read the first post of this thread: http://www.mychevysparkev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=3643