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DSpark

Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6
How many miles do you get per hour plugged into a regular outlet?

I hear anywhere from 3 to 6 miles. And what determines how much you get? The circuit breaker? The quality of your electrical lines? The Spark EV's internal charger? How does this all compare to other EVs charging from the wall plug?

Please state your miles per hour charge! :)
 
DSpark said:
How many miles do you get per hour plugged into a regular outlet?

I hear anywhere from 3 to 6 miles. And what determines how much you get? The circuit breaker? The quality of your electrical lines? The Spark EV's internal charger? How does this all compare to other EVs charging from the wall plug?

Please state your miles per hour charge! :)

The big variables are how you drive and the weather. It does not depend much upon the house wiring or even the Spark charger (apart from its default setting).

The EVSE (the charging unit you plug into the wall) tells the Spark the maximum current it can charge at, although the Spark doesn't have to use all that.

One annoyance is that the Spark defaults to charging at 8 Amps, with an option on the charging screen to charge at 12Amps, but you have to set it each time you charge. I normally do it while I'm driving home.

The power that is delivered to the car also depends upon the voltage so if the house wiring or an extension cord causes a voltage drop the delivered to be lower so try to avoid using a long extension cord.

Virtually all EVs charge at 12Amps from a 120V outlet except that the Tesla seems to push it to about 14A.

8 Amps results in about 1kW charging or ~1.4kW at 12Amps.

Because of losses the battery will only charge at about 750W or 1.1kW respectively.

The miles/hour you get when charging depend upon the efficiency of the car - the Spark is one of the most efficient and so actually gets more charge per hour than most others when charging from 120V. However if you drive aggressively the miles/kWh you get will be lower and so you will not charge as many miles per hour.

The Spark is not as good as most other cars when charging from 240V (level 2) - there the 3.3kW on board charger is a limitation, most other cars these days have a 6.6kW charger or even more.

I usually get about 5 miles of range per hour of charging when using 12Amps at 120V. A Leaf would probably get a bit less and a Tesla a bit less still (even with its higher charge rate). My normal energy consumption is ~5.7miles/kWh as indicated on the dash display. It's bit lower in the winter and higher in the spring/fall.

kevin
 
Sounds good! Looks like you get 5 miles per hour through the standard wall plug. If we can get more people to respond it would be interesting to see if others are getting the same number or if it's higher or lower than 5 miles per charge. Keep the answers coming! :)
 
My stock 120V L1 EVSE has not been touched since I bought the car. (I should test it....)
Once you have an inexpensive 15A 240V L2 EVSE, L1's seem silly.
I think of it as an emergency backup.
 
NORTON said:
My stock 120V L1 EVSE has not been touched since I bought the car. (I should test it....)
Once you have an inexpensive 15A 240V L2 EVSE, L1's seem silly.
I think of it as an emergency backup.

Thanks for your, um, non-reply! :(

I'm trying to get numbers from people whom actually use it, thanks.
 
You've got the only answer that makes sense: you get X kWh from 8 amps, 12 amps, and 220 volts. Nothing is going to change there.


How many miles you get from a kWh of driving is a separate topic and highly subjective. And it's been answered: it depends on how you drive, along with factors such as tire pressure, which tires you have, the weather, traffic flow, sunspots. There's a range from say 3.5 to 5.5 miles kWh. As the saying goes, your milage may vary.
 
nikwax said:
..you get X kWh from 8 amps, 12 amps, and 220 volts. Nothing is going to change there.
....How many miles you get from a kWh of driving is a separate topic and highly subjective. ...

This is the answer above. There is no hard set 'MPH of Charging'. It depends on how you use the car.

The battery display is a two part affair. The cylindrical, segmented battery SOC (state of charge) and the miles display GOM (guess-o-meter).
They are somewhat independent. The GOM does not know how you will be using the car today. Its number comes from previous driving/charge cycles.
If you load the car to the max and head up the mountains at 75 MPH with the heat blasting you will be lucky to get half of the GOM miles.

I'm just saying, if you are only leasing and think you can get by with L1 charging, fine.
But if you really want to enjoy EV life you'll want an L2 around the house.
 
DSpark said:
NORTON said:
My stock 120V L1 EVSE has not been touched since I bought the car. (I should test it....)
Once you have an inexpensive 15A 240V L2 EVSE, L1's seem silly.
I think of it as an emergency backup.

Thanks for your, um, non-reply! :(

I'm trying to get numbers from people whom actually use it, thanks.

As others have commented, the charging part will vary little from user to user. The variability comes from estimating how the energy will be used.

For example if you were filling up a gasoline car at 1 gallon per minute and you got 40mpg - you would get 40 miles of range per minute of filling. If however you are an aggressive driver and only get 25mpg you will only get 25 miles of range per minute.

It is similar on the Spark. If you are charging at 12Amps on 120V it will take ~17 hours to fill, that 17 hours could be 100 miles for the gentle driver or only 70 for the aggressive one.

kevin
 
Gotcha, I understand everyone's answers. I guess I didn't explain my question correctly so here it is:

Example: You drive home and your GOM shows 20 miles remaining before you shut off the motor. You plug in the 120V for 6 hours. When you start the car again, the GOM shows 50 miles, meaning in that 6 hours you gained 30 miles (5 miles an hour times 6 hours) from the wall.

So in this scenario you're gaining 5 miles per hour. I understand at that point, if you drive like a maniac you won't be getting that the numbers the GOM expects or vice versa. I'm just really interested in that number-per-hour when someone wakes up and start the car and how much they've accumulated per hour plugged into the wall. At work, if I plug the car in for 9 hours, it would be quite a difference getting 45 miles back (5 per hour) versus 36 miles (4 per hour).

Does that make more sense?
 
DSpark said:
Gotcha, I understand everyone's answers. I guess I didn't explain my question correctly so here it is:

Example: You drive home and your GOM shows 20 miles remaining before you shut off the motor. You plug in the 120V for 6 hours. When you start the car again, the GOM shows 50 miles, meaning in that 6 hours you gained 30 miles (5 miles an hour times 6 hours) from the wall.

So in this scenario you're gaining 5 miles per hour. I understand at that point, if you drive like a maniac you won't be getting that the numbers the GOM expects or vice versa. I'm just really interested in that number-per-hour when someone wakes up and start the car and how much they've accumulated per hour plugged into the wall. At work, if I plug the car in for 9 hours, it would be quite a difference getting 45 miles back (5 per hour) versus 36 miles (4 per hour).

Does that make more sense?

"if you drive like a maniac you won't be getting that the numbers the GOM expects or vice versa."

If you drive consistently then the GOM should adjust to your driving style - and so after charging would display something close to the expected range.

The GOM averages your recent driving history to determine the displayed number. I haven't seen that anyone has managed to determine precisely how long or what particular algorithm it uses. The range estimators on all cars (EV and gasoline) suffer from the problem that they can't see the future so if conditions change it will over or under estimate.

My commute to work loses about 500 feet in elevation while the trip back climbs the same amount, that confuses the estimator as I use about 1kWh less going to work than coming home and the range displayed is pessimistic in one direction and optimistic in the other.

kevin
 
DSpark said:
Gotcha, I understand everyone's answers. I guess I didn't explain my question correctly so here it is:

Example: You drive home and your GOM shows 20 miles remaining before you shut off the motor. You plug in the 120V for 6 hours. When you start the car again, the GOM shows 50 miles, meaning in that 6 hours you gained 30 miles (5 miles an hour times 6 hours) from the wall.

So in this scenario you're gaining 5 miles per hour. I understand at that point, if you drive like a maniac you won't be getting that the numbers the GOM expects or vice versa. I'm just really interested in that number-per-hour when someone wakes up and start the car and how much they've accumulated per hour plugged into the wall. At work, if I plug the car in for 9 hours, it would be quite a difference getting 45 miles back (5 per hour) versus 36 miles (4 per hour).

Does that make more sense?

My experience with the 120 VAC EVSE supplied with the car is this - for every kWh supplied to the car, only 65% of that goes into the battery. If you are charging at the 8 amp rate (~1 kWh) you will actually put ~.65 kWh into the battery each hour; charging losses make up the rest. If your driving habit averages 5 mi / kWh, you will be adding approximately 3.25 mi / hour back into the battery. If you have a heavy foot or use the heater a lot, and the car averages only 4 mi / kWh, you will put 2.6 mi / hour back into the battery. Multiply you driving mi / kwh number by 18 (2015 Spark EV) and you will get the approximate range you can drive before having to get out and push the car. In mild weather my guess-o-meter reads at 105 miles after a full charge. In cold weather - like it is now - I get about 77 miles as I do use the heater.
 
Last night I got 41 miles increase for 8 hours of charging at 12 amps: roughly 5 miles per hour. In the summer, I get roughly 6 miles per hour charge.

When charging at 8 amps I get aprox 2-3 mph charged. Haven't done it for awhile, but it was significantly slower for sure.

According to Onstar my MPGe lifetime is 143 and Since Full Charge 155. I consider myself a fairly conservative, miserly driver.. most of the time. Sometimes you just have to floor the little Sparky.

I agree with the others in that weather, and driving style play a big role in your total miles gained. I would add speed of travel too.

If I drive only in the city ie less than 45 mph my range sky rockets. If I have to drive on the freeway my range decreases a lot when driving 55 mph or over, compared to city driving.
 
NORTON said:
But if you really want to enjoy EV life you'll want an L2 around the house.

This statement absent any context is about as meaningless or silly as asking how many miles you get per hour charging. I've got a L1 and can't think of any situation when I would have been "enjoyed" having an L2 at home. I've used DCFC and L2 away from home, but I've never had a situation where I needed more charge when I left my house to drive somewhere.
 
Garrity said:
Last night I got 41 miles increase for 8 hours of charging at 12 amps: roughly 5 miles per hour. In the summer, I get roughly 6 miles per hour charge.

This is exactly what I'm looking for! Thanks! Interesting you get 6 miles in the summer after unplugging the charging cable - I wonder why that is?
 
Homer said:
... or silly as asking how many miles you get per hour charging.

Why is the question silly? You said you also use a L1 charger, and for someone who is contemplating getting an ev, it's important for me to know if I plug in for 9 hours at work how many miles I can expect to get back when I unplug. Getting 2 miles per hour versus 5 miles is a big difference, no? Did you not think it was important to know this before you got your ev?
 
DSpark said:
Interesting you get 6 miles in the summer after unplugging the charging cable - I wonder why that is?

Weather.

Generally speaking, the colder it is, the less efficient EV's become. I used to average in the high 80's 90's miles range in the summer, now with the mild winters of Central Valley California I only get 70's miles for range.

I believe that is why other posters are being more precise by focusing in on how much kw per hour you can charge your battery on a 120 v plug.



Weather, driving style, average speed you travel at, and elevation change are the main factors that effect your range.
that is why context is needed to fully answer the question.

What's the weather like where you live, how far do you have to travel to work, how fast do you drive on way to work, and do you encounter any hills or mountains on the way? If you supply those answers, forum members can give you a better estimate on if you will make it using a 120 v plug, and if you can drive like a bandit or stick to hypermiling.
 
Homer said:
NORTON said:
But if you really want to enjoy EV life you'll want an L2 around the house.

This statement absent any context is about as meaningless or silly as asking how many miles you get per hour charging. I've got a L1 and can't think of any situation when I would have been "enjoyed" having an L2 at home. I've used DCFC and L2 away from home, but I've never had a situation where I needed more charge when I left my house to drive somewhere.
I agree. Everyone has different needs with EV ownership.

I was a 'No Charge at Home Warrior' for my first 7 months of ownership. 8k miles @ Zero $!!

I just recently started using my home L2 with the cold weather here.
I want to make sure the battery's TMS works as needed when plugged in. I still use DCFC on weekends as required.

If you are shooting for least amount of total $$/mile an L1 is the cheapest way to go.

For $300-400 you can have an L2 at home and the dollars spent on home electrons could be less in the long run because of 'charging efficiency' using 3.3kW instead of 1kW or 1.4kW.
More goes into the battery and less into the 'Overhead' of the charging system.
And you get the added benefits of having the car ready for an unexpected trip and less is drawn from the battery during a 'Precondition' in cold or hot weather.

Run the numbers. An L2 may have a payoff,, someday.

And again,, adding kWh's to the battery at the 3 different L1 and L2 rates is a known number.
How you turn those kWh's into miles is a variable number.

EDIT: If it is really cold or hot some of the charge power will go to the battery's TMS, but the draw from the grid remains the same.
So when TMS is operating less of the kWh's go to charging the battery.
 
8 months ago a friend of mine told me about the special lease deal Chevrolet was making on the 2015 Spark EV with DCFC. He even let me take the car for a short test drive. A month later I had my own 2015 Spark EV 2LT with DCFC and I set foot on a path of incredible fun and learning. In August I added a 2014 Spark EV without DCFC. I discovered that there is a lot to learn about an EV - vehicle charging, weather and speed impact on range, etc. as compared to an ICE vehicle. Today, 7 months and 7000 miles later, I feel very comfortable with both vehicles. I have had many questions along the way and, fortunately, I usually could find or get an answer on this blog from those who started down the learning path before me. They have provided information that you will not find available at any dealer.

So, DSpark and others - keep asking those questions. Newbies are looking for answers to their questions too and your question and the answers provided on this blog might be just what they needed.

Merry Christmas to Spark EV Drivers Everywhere
 
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