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 Post subject: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:46 pm 
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I have gotten the impression that driving up hills can significantly affect range. Could I drive my 2016 Spark EV a distance of 53 miles with a 3000 ft increase in elevation (from 2800 ft to 5800 ft)?

Thanks.


Last edited by DavidH on Mon Jul 09, 2018 8:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:22 pm 
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yes of course


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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:04 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
Posts: 832
Location: Manteca, California
DavidH wrote:
I have gotten the impression that driving up hills can significantly affect range. Could I drive my 2016 Spark EV a distance of 53 miles with a 3000 ft increase in elevation (from 2800 ft to 5800 ft)?

Thanks.

Yes, it can be done but I have a few comments and questions. Driving up hills can significantly affect your range depending the distance up the grade and and the percent grade you plan to climb. You plan to climb from 2800 ft to 5800 ft in what distance? Is there a DCFC station along your route where you can charge before tackling the summit trip? Is the 53 miles one way from your home to the summit? Once you are at the summit you can put the car in L to drive back down and use regen to add charge back into the battery. But, you will probably need to have a charging location in mind on your return trip to make sure you have sufficient charge in your battery to get home.


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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:32 pm 
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MrDRMorgan wrote:
DavidH wrote:
I have gotten the impression that driving up hills can significantly affect range. Could I drive my 2016 Spark EV a distance of 53 miles with a 3000 ft increase in elevation (from 2800 ft to 5800 ft)?

Thanks.

Yes, it can be done but I have a few comments and questions. Driving up hills can significantly affect your range depending the distance up the grade and and the percent grade you plan to climb. You plan to climb from 2800 ft to 5800 ft in what distance? Is there a DCFC station along your route where you can charge before tackling the summit trip? Is the 53 miles one way from your home to the summit? Once you are at the summit you can put the car in L to drive back down and use regen to add charge back into the battery. But, you will probably need to have a charging location in mind on your return trip to make sure you have sufficient charge in your battery to get home.


It is 53 miles from Nevada City to Truckee. In Truckee there are several places where I can charge. After charging a few hours (and reading several chapters of my book), I plan to continue (an additional 45 miles) on to South Lake Tahoe where a friend has a cabin (and electricity). After a few days, I will reverse the process.


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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:19 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
Posts: 832
Location: Manteca, California
DavidH wrote:
MrDRMorgan wrote:
DavidH wrote:
I have gotten the impression that driving up hills can significantly affect range. Could I drive my 2016 Spark EV a distance of 53 miles with a 3000 ft increase in elevation (from 2800 ft to 5800 ft)?

Thanks.

Yes, it can be done but I have a few comments and questions. Driving up hills can significantly affect your range depending the distance up the grade and and the percent grade you plan to climb. You plan to climb from 2800 ft to 5800 ft in what distance? Is there a DCFC station along your route where you can charge before tackling the summit trip? Is the 53 miles one way from your home to the summit? Once you are at the summit you can put the car in L to drive back down and use regen to add charge back into the battery. But, you will probably need to have a charging location in mind on your return trip to make sure you have sufficient charge in your battery to get home.


It is 53 miles from Nevada City to Truckee. In Truckee there are several places where I can charge. After charging a few hours (and reading several chapters of my book), I plan to continue (an additional 45 miles) on to South Lake Tahoe where a friend has a cabin (and electricity). After a few days, I will reverse the process.

This should be an easy trip. You have DCFC stations at Soda Springs and Truckee. Around Lake Tahoe you also have DCFC stations at Tahoe City, Incline Village and South Lake Tahoe. There are also a number of L2 EVSE locations along your route. Use http://www.plugshare.com to make sure stations along your route are working and, if when you get there you find the station is not working, know where you can find a backup station that is working. The trip back down will really be fun. Be sure to put the car in L for maximum regeneration. When you return home, try to have about 50% remaining in your HV battery when you crest at Donner Summit and start down the hill towards Nevada City. This will allow the power generated by regeneration to be stored in the HV battery.

About 3 years ago, my wife and I drove our 2015 Spark EV up HWY 50 to South Lake Tahoe from our home in Manteca, CA - about 150 miles one way. The climb from Folsom to Pollock Pines was a bit steep and, by the time we reached Pollock Pines, my remaining range made me a bit uncomfortable, but we made it. Now there are more DCFC charging stations available along that route.

I have considered a drive to Reno and back but the climb from Reno to Truckee looks like a real challenge and I do not want to drive up that grade to Truckee at 25 mph.


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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:44 am 
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MrDRMorgan-

There are now EVgo DCFC stations about every 10 or 15 miles up I-80 between Auburn and Truckee ; they went live over the past 6 months. The drive Sac-> Reno for a SparkEV driver is no longer the challenge that it was a year ago.


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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:47 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
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Location: Manteca, California
SparkE wrote:
MrDRMorgan-

There are now EVgo DCFC stations about every 10 or 15 miles up I-80 between Auburn and Truckee ; they went live over the past 6 months. The drive Sac-> Reno for a SparkEV driver is no longer the challenge that it was a year ago.

Very true - IF he drives down to Auburn from Nevada City and then up Hwy 80. His other option is to drive 41 miles up Hwy 20 and merge with Hwy 80 at Yuba Pass which would leave him with DCFCs at Soda Springs and at Truckee. He mentioned his trip was 53 miles to Truckee so I assumed he plans to take Hwy 20.

I recently took two trips from my home in Manteca to Utah and Idaho and I went over Hwy 80 specifically to see if I thought I could get to Reno and back. I did not see any problems getting to Truckee because of the additional DCFC stations you mentioned. Going downhill into Reno is no problem either.

BUT... the two EVgo DCFC stations in Reno occasionally seem to have some reliability problems. And, the climb up Hwy 80 from Reno to Truckee is steep and long enough to cause me some concern unless I tried it at much less than 55 mph. This doesn't work for me and other drivers on the highway probably would not like me creeping up the grade either. I am sure some other Spark EV drivers have driven from Reno to Sacramento and I sure would like to know how the did it.


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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 5:26 am 
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I seem to recall (can't remember *where* I read it) that one should count approx 1.5 kWh per 1000 feet of elevation rise, in addition to the kWh consumed driving a distance on flat, at a certain speed.

Reno elevation : 4500
Truckee elevation : 5817
Donner summit elevation : 7,239 . (donner summit is west of truckee, not on the Reno side)
distance Reno -> Truckee : 34 miles

So the drive on flat ground would take about 8 kWh (a bit less, the way I drive)
And the elevation change would take 2-2.5 kWh - heck double it to 5 kWh

13 kWh is really doable. But if you want to be cautious the first time you drive it, when the steep grade up starts, get behind a big-rig (NOT close, at a safe distance, simply behind it) and the swirling, broken-up air of the big-rig will lessen the wind factor, AND you will be going up at a slower pace during the big climb, thus also reducing your kWh consumption. Sure, it will be slower, but (IIRC) the climb is only about 10 miles, and the difference between 60 mph and 35 mph means that it would take maybe an extra 10 minutes. That would reassure you for the next trip, when you got to the top with 30-40% SoC. At truckee you fill to 70-80%, and then off you go to climb to donner summitt, then all the way down to Auburn or Loomis or Roseville - then a top-up in Galt for insurance.


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 Post subject: Re: Range/change in elevation
PostPosted: Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:03 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
Posts: 832
Location: Manteca, California
SparkE wrote:
I seem to recall (can't remember *where* I read it) that one should count approx 1.5 kWh per 1000 feet of elevation rise, in addition to the kWh consumed driving a distance on flat, at a certain speed.

Reno elevation : 4500
Truckee elevation : 5817
Donner summit elevation : 7,239 . (donner summit is west of truckee, not on the Reno side)
distance Reno -> Truckee : 34 miles

So the drive on flat ground would take about 8 kWh (a bit less, the way I drive)
And the elevation change would take 2-2.5 kWh - heck double it to 5 kWh

13 kWh is really doable. But if you want to be cautious the first time you drive it, when the steep grade up starts, get behind a big-rig (NOT close, at a safe distance, simply behind it) and the swirling, broken-up air of the big-rig will lessen the wind factor, AND you will be going up at a slower pace during the big climb, thus also reducing your kWh consumption. Sure, it will be slower, but (IIRC) the climb is only about 10 miles, and the difference between 60 mph and 35 mph means that it would take maybe an extra 10 minutes. That would reassure you for the next trip, when you got to the top with 30-40% SoC. At truckee you fill to 70-80%, and then off you go to climb to donner summitt, then all the way down to Auburn or Loomis or Roseville - then a top-up in Galt for insurance.

I am still considering giving it a try but drafting a Big Rig, even though drafting works great, leaves something to be desired as far as the view is concerned. :D


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