MoldyWalnuts
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:33 pm

Re: Battery degredation

Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:44 pm

so this is what i'm getting after my no A/C run to the store just now. with 51% usage the HV battery capacity is up to 16.27 kWh.

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MoldyWalnuts
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:33 pm

Re: Battery degredation

Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:17 pm

last calculated HV battery capacity before i recharge is 16.375 kWh

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TheLondonBroiler
Posts: 227
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2017 6:25 am

Re: Battery degredation

Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:08 pm

MoldyWalnuts wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:17 pm
last calculated HV battery capacity before i recharge is 16.375 kWh
That's pretty good considering the amount of miles on it. It would be interesting to see all the usage data (number of fast charges, daily SOC data, lifetime battery temps), to see correlations between degradation and particular use cases. GM certainly has this data and hopefully is making more good use of it (they made the Bolt and did a pretty good job).
2015 Spark EV w/ DCFC 46,XXX miles
Purchased 1/20/18 w/ 16,5XX miles
0-40k mile efficiency avg - 5.3 mi/kwh

2019 Bolt EV w/ DCFC 59,XXX miles
Purchased 3/16/19 w/ 87 miles
Lifetime efficiency avg - 4.6 mi/kwh

MoldyWalnuts
Posts: 24
Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2019 1:33 pm

Re: Battery degredation

Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:37 pm

not bad at all, 16.375 kWh is 86.2% of 19 kWh new battery capacity after 4 years of use. still it doesn't explain the sudden drop in the GOM from about 100 miles in March of '19, when i bought the car, to about 80 miles right now... then again, perhaps the GOM has simply become more accurate, since new Spark EVs, if i'm not mistaken, were rated at 82 miles, not 100 like it used to show.

also, imho, mileage is not a showstopper with EVs, but HV battery age is and mine is 4 years old this June. i bought it for much less because of this "high" mileage but i didn't think much of it since the HV battery was relatively fresh and the car's condition was excellent indicating mostly freeway miles. i'm just hoping that the previous owner mostly used 120V to charge it overnight for his daily commute like i do, but i'll never know that...

to add, so far i've replaced the front tires which were original and still had some thread left but they were cheap ($40 a piece at onlinetires.com which i recommend because they will match lower prices that you will find online and also offer free shipping) and i did the work myself with the help of harbor freight tire irons and bubble balancer. by the way, i installed the tires with the red dot facing the air nipple and the balancing was perfect, there was no need to change the weights. just a little bonus i got for all my hard work ;)

NORTON
Posts: 1310
Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 5:52 am
Location: KC,MO

Re: Battery degredation

Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:36 am

NORTON wrote:
Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:35 am
MoldyWalnuts wrote:
Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:44 pm
so this is what i'm getting after my no A/C run to the store just now. with 51% usage the HV battery capacity is up to 16.27 kWh.
You say you didn't have the cabin AC on and yet the display shows only 'Climate Settings' power usage.
Does that mean that battery cooling is not displayed as Batter Conditioning, even though that's the only thing using the AC's power???

I know in the winter I can see Climate and BC displayed.
As I said, there are two separate coolant loops with their own coolant heaters, one for the cabin and one for the battery.

Maybe it doesn't even try to show where AC power is being used and just displays it as Climate Settings.

Strange.
If so, you still can learn something new about this car. Does the Bolt display power usage the same way?
Used '14 2LT w/ DCFC. +83k miles.
Mostly free charging! Only one LONG visit to the shop....
GM needs Modern Troubleshooting tools for Modern EV's.
3 step Trouble Tree, 1st try car died again, 2nd try not covered / cost $800. 3rd try fixed the problem.

marcusku
Posts: 4
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2020 4:48 pm

Re: Battery degredation

Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:01 pm

Newbie in search of a 2016 Spark. I'm looking at one with about 30k miles and the dealer said they would take it to a Chevy dealer to test the capacity. In reading other posts looks like I should expect around 14-15 kWh? Any opinions on what number would be unacceptable? I'll probably only be driving 10 miles/day so shouldn't matter so much but I do live in WI so I'll lose a lot of capacity in the winter.

Do batteries degrade based more on time or miles? i.e should I look harder for one with lower miles?

Thanks!

NORTON
Posts: 1310
Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 5:52 am
Location: KC,MO

Re: Battery degredation

Mon Jul 27, 2020 6:03 am

marcusku wrote:
Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:01 pm
....the dealer said they would take it to a Chevy dealer to test the capacity. ...
You can get the real number yourself by taking it on a 1 to 1.5 hr test drive. Don't you pay for any official testing. Don't you pay asking price. :lol:
Look at 'Trusted Professions'. See where used car salesmen are? Don't believe most of what they say. They have that status for a reason.... :roll:

You do the math from the numbers shown on the 'Energy Usage' page after the long test drive.
You have to start with the battery fully charged, ideally you watch them unplug it and then drive it until you use more than 50%, hopefully lots more.

I wouldn't sweat it..... Are there any Spark EV's with really bad batteries compared to others?
Used '14 2LT w/ DCFC. +83k miles.
Mostly free charging! Only one LONG visit to the shop....
GM needs Modern Troubleshooting tools for Modern EV's.
3 step Trouble Tree, 1st try car died again, 2nd try not covered / cost $800. 3rd try fixed the problem.

TheLondonBroiler
Posts: 227
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2017 6:25 am

Re: Battery degredation

Mon Jul 27, 2020 7:23 am

marcusku wrote:
Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:01 pm
Newbie in search of a 2016 Spark. I'm looking at one with about 30k miles and the dealer said they would take it to a Chevy dealer to test the capacity. In reading other posts looks like I should expect around 14-15 kWh?
So long as the battery warranty is valid, I see this as a moot point. 14kwh for a 2016 "SHOULD BE" the basement.
marcusku wrote:
Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:01 pm
Any opinions on what number would be unacceptable? I'll probably only be driving 10 miles/day so shouldn't matter so much but I do live in WI so I'll lose a lot of capacity in the winter.
The worst capacity I recall hearing about was 13kwh on a '15, but if you're only driving 10 miles per day, even that would be more than sufficient. That being said, I think it's safe to say, there are going to be instances where you'll want/need to drive further, and you REALLY need to ask yourself if the Spark will work for you in those instances. When I was buying mine, I was commuting 60 miles roundtrip with no charging at work, so I set 16kwh as a minimum (the Spark wasn't a particularly good choice for my particular use case). Keep in mind, the 2016 battery warranty threshold is 60% for 2016, so Chevy isn't liable to do squat unless you fall below 10.8kwh, and even then (depending on the dealership) you might have to kick and scream for them to fulfill their warranty obligations.
marcusku wrote:
Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:01 pm
Do batteries degrade based more on time or miles? i.e should I look harder for one with lower miles?
This is the million dollar question that there's no solid answer to. There are so many variables that can impact capacity that it's impossible to say or know. Storing a Spark at 100% or "0%" for long periods can be very detrimental. Lots of fast charging, heavy acceleration, and full discharge cycles are supposedly bad too. The only thing that you could remotely have a clue to past treatment, is if it still has original tires on the front and there's very little tread wear (they have the week and year of manufacture on them), you might assume the previous driver rarely, if ever, drove it hard.

I'm really getting into the weeds here (and I could go further, but I don't think it would be helpful), the bottom line, most important question, is still, Is this vehicle going to work for you and meet your needs?

I know this next statement is unsolicited, off topic, and I apologize in advance if it's not helpful, but if I knew 2.5 years ago what I know now, I would have bought a Volt instead of a Spark. I really do like the Spark, but the Volt would have been so much more appropriate for MY use scenarios.

Good luck
2015 Spark EV w/ DCFC 46,XXX miles
Purchased 1/20/18 w/ 16,5XX miles
0-40k mile efficiency avg - 5.3 mi/kwh

2019 Bolt EV w/ DCFC 59,XXX miles
Purchased 3/16/19 w/ 87 miles
Lifetime efficiency avg - 4.6 mi/kwh

MrDRMorgan
Posts: 1132
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
Location: Manteca in Central California

Re: Battery degredation

Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:57 pm

I have been fortunate to have driven all three model years and I still have the 2014 and 2016 models. Here is the battery degradation I have experienced for each model year -

2015 Spark EV 2LT with DCFC - leased (calculated from Energy Information screen data)
1. 01 Jul 15: 1414 miles on ODO - calculated battery capacity was 18.8 kWh
2. 05 Dec 17: 24008 miles on ODO - Check engine light came on, charging part replaced, battery capacity dropped 1.3 kWh (17.09 kWh to 15.79kWh) after repair.
3. 31Mar 2018: 26508 miles on ODO - calculated battery capacity was 15.5 kWh

2014 Spark EV 2LT without DCFC - TorquePro measurements
1. 10 June 2018: 14144 miles on ODO - 17.2 kWh
2. 26 July 2020: 24207 miles on ODO - 15.0 kWh

2016 Spark EV 2LT with DCFC - TorquePro measurements
1. 10 June 2018: 10284 miles on the ODO - 16.6 kWh
2. 20 June 2020: 31229 miles on the ODO: 14.4 kWh

Using TorquePro, I also measured the battery capacity for a friend of mine, who had a leased 2016 Spark EV and was getting ready to turn it in. His ODO was around 33K miles. The TorquePro measurement was 14.8 kWh.

ElDobro
Posts: 74
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:05 pm
Location: NJ

Re: Battery degredation

Mon Jul 27, 2020 3:38 pm

My battery's holding at 12.4kWh, and I still don't have any issues with my range.

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