Request for comment: ICED, Leafed, Leaf*cker

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SparkevBlogspot

Well-known member
Joined
May 25, 2015
Messages
499
I got so fed up with Leaf, that I wrote several blog post about it. I harped on their slow charging, but latest one's specially for terms. Leafed (like Iced), and Leaf*ckers who purposely take dual head charger when perfectly good Chademo is empty next to it. What do you think? :twisted:

http://sparkev.blogspot.com/2015/10/jerks-all-around-us-iced-leafed.html
 
nikwax said:
Not sure what you're trying to accomplish. With everything that's going on in the world, this comes across as petty.
It seems every time I need to use DCFC for intercity travel, I'm waiting for Leaf. And they always charge slower than 6kW using DCFC (Leafracked) when they could be using L2 instead. After witnessing few Leaf drivers plugging into dualhead charger when perfectly working Chademo is sitting empty (Leafrackers), I'm blowing off some steam and putting some terminology.

I can't be the only one having so many issues with Leaf, but then maybe other SparkEV drivers don't travel intercity or don't pay attention that Leaf is charging so slowly? SparkEV has completely replaced my gas car.

Something else I found is that Leaf causes AM radio interference when using DCFC while SparkEV doesn't. I don't know if this is Chademo or Leaf problem, but I hate missing "What the H did Jesse Jackson say" when charging next to Leaf.

Oh, and what I'm try to accomplish is to make the problem be known. If it affect some change so that Leaf don't hog DCFC as they are doing now, that'll be even better. Either cap free charging to 40KW or higher (60% in Leaf) or do something. Also have some way to prevent Leafrackers. Current situation is bad for everyone by having needless waiting.
 
nikwax said:
Not sure what you're trying to accomplish. With everything that's going on in the world, this comes across as petty.

Don't hate. You can say something like "with all that's going on in the world" for just about anything. "Why shower with everything going on in the world (said in sad Eore voice from Winne the Pooh)"
 
SparkevBlogspot said:
nikwax said:
Not sure what you're trying to accomplish. With everything that's going on in the world, this comes across as petty.
It seems every time I need to use DCFC for intercity travel, I'm waiting for Leaf. And they always charge slower than 6kW using DCFC (Leafracked) when they could be using L2 instead. After witnessing few Leaf drivers plugging into dualhead charger when perfectly working Chademo is sitting empty (Leafrackers), I'm blowing off some steam and putting some terminology.

I can't be the only one having so many issues with Leaf, but then maybe other SparkEV drivers don't travel intercity or don't pay attention that Leaf is charging so slowly? SparkEV has completely replaced my gas car.

Something else I found is that Leaf causes AM radio interference when using DCFC while SparkEV doesn't. I don't know if this is Chademo or Leaf problem, but I hate missing "What the H did Jesse Jackson say" when charging next to Leaf.

Oh, and what I'm try to accomplish is to make the problem be known. If it affect some change so that Leaf don't hog DCFC as they are doing now, that'll be even better. Either cap free charging to 40KW or higher (60% in Leaf) or do something. Also have some way to prevent Leafrackers. Current situation is bad for everyone by having needless waiting.

Hey man don't be over enthusiastic about your views...people don't like that here lol.
 
nozferatu said:
Hey man don't be over enthusiastic about your views...people don't like that here lol.
After getting Leafracked (waiting for Leaf charging at 4kW) for hours and hours and hours, I had to blow off some steam. I don't know if me making noise or just coincidence, but it has gotten lot better since. I still get Leafed (waiting for Leaf charging at 20 kW or some such), just not as often.
 
SparkevBlogspot said:
I got so fed up with Leaf, that I wrote several blog post about it. I harped on their slow charging, but latest one's specially for terms. Leafed (like Iced), and Leaf*ckers who purposely take dual head charger when perfectly good Chademo is empty next to it. What do you think? :twisted:

What is your objective?

Keep in mind that our Spark EVs will be the ones with tiny batteries only charging at 50 kW, hogging the DC chargers for "hours and hours and hours" in a few years time. Demonizing the Leaf, for whatever deficiencies it may have, does not seem like it will have a positive impact on anything.

When I have had to wait for other cars, nobody seemed comfortably letting their car charge much past 80% when there was someone waiting. A polite chat with the driver of the Leaf may be enlightening to both of you. Perhaps there was a reason they chose the charger they did, like the other one was busy when they arrived.

All I got out of the blog was someone ranting about having to wait their turn to use a shared resource.
 
Chocula said:
What is your objective?
From the first post in this thread, "what I'm try to accomplish is to make the problem be known."

Chocula said:
Keep in mind that our Spark EVs will be the ones with tiny batteries only charging at 50 kW, hogging the DC chargers for "hours and hours and hours" in a few years time.
SparkEV might have tiny battery, but in terms of time spent at DCFC, it's quickest in the world. It's even quicker than Tesla's 120kW charger for time spent "hogging". With Bolt's 60kWh and no interest in upgrading to higher power CCS charger, SparkEV will remain quickest charging EV (least hogging EV) for years to come.

http://sparkev.blogspot.com/2015/12/sparkev-is-quickest-charging-ev-in-world.html

Chocula said:
When I have had to wait for other cars, nobody seemed comfortably letting their car charge much past 80% when there was someone waiting.
I don't know where you charge, but almost all Leaf I encounter charge full 30 minutes, whether they're 80% (20kW out of 50kW) or 95% (and 2kW power out of 50kW charger). It's free for them, they don't seem to care. I do chat sometimes, but most of the time the driver is away. I mention this in the blog.

Chocula said:
A polite chat with the driver of the LEAF may be enlightening to both of you.
That's one of the reasons why I wrote the blog: to enlighten and make the problem be known. None of the Leaf owners were aware that they were charging so slowly. They only saw 50kW, not 4kW that they were actually charging until I pointed out.

Chocula said:
Perhaps there was a reason they chose the charger they did, like the other one was busy when they arrived.
Again, I address this in my blog post. I am specifically referring to those who pull into dual head charger instead of Chademo AND witnessing that.

Chocula said:
All I got out of the blog was someone ranting about having to wait their turn to use a shared resource.
If you don't use DCFC for intercity travel (ie, popular spots), you won't understand the frustration of waiting for Leaf after Leaf charging at 4kW (or even 2kW) while the driver is away.
 
I find that 90% of the time, a little education goes a long way regarding charging etiquette. Most people literally just never thought about the specific implications of their actions on the bigger picture. Be friendly, mention that if they make X change then it will help others in different situations out, and you can practically see the light bulb in their head turn on while they have a chuckle and share the resource.

Remember, nearly every single person you encounter is driving their first EV, and many times this might be the only DC charging location or system they've used at all. They don't know the details of the charging equipment, unique standards, etc. so bear with them and welcome them to the family. Having congestion at a fast charger is a HIGH QUALITY problem which didn't exist 5 years ago. Now we have lots of EVs to choose from, different fast charging standards in use, and infrastructure to compete for...all new in the last 5 years!!!

Bryce
 
Nashco said:
....Remember, nearly every single person you encounter is driving their first EV, .... They don't know the details of the charging equipment, ..., different fast charging standards in use, ...
Too true.
So show a little patience and compassion,,, and try not to laugh !!!! :lol:

 
Nashco said:
....Remember, nearly every single person you encounter is driving their first EV, .... They don't know the details of the charging equipment, ..., different fast charging standards in use, ...
It may be their first EV, but they're seasoned fast chargers as many drive Leaf from years ago. I try to educate them, but it's not possible when the driver is away. Some (many) just ignore that Leaf is charging at 2kW using 50kW charger, and that switching to L2 would be just as quick for them. Waiting for hours and hours (and hours and ...) got me so frustrated that I wrote the blog post to make the problem be known. It's mainly free charging that's causing problems.

http://sparkev.blogspot.com/2015/10/free-charging-sucks.html

But I also have blog post to educate Leaf DCFC users.

http://sparkev.blogspot.com/2015/10/love-letter-to-nissan-leaf-dcfc-users.html

Being SparkEV blog, I don't know how many read it. But some Leaf drivers helped me get the data so other Leaf drivers can benefit not only for optimal charging, but also to save money when free charging eventually expire. 2 years, dear lord, that seems like forever...
 
SparkevBlogspot said:
....Being SparkEV blog, I don't know how many read it. ...

So go to Leaf Forums and other EV forums and pitch your b**ch and post your links.

Maybe you can find others that don't love free electrons.
 
NORTON said:
So go to Leaf Forums and other EV forums and pitch your b**ch and post your links. Maybe you can find others that don't love free electrons.
I did. That's how I got others to help with Leaf data.

As for free, there is no such thing. In case of "free" charging, all those who use DCFC pay as extra waiting that wouldn't be without "free", sometimes significantly so. Those of us who pay money to DCFC pay "double" as waiting time + money as well.
 
I comprehend your frustration. What you have to realize is this is predictable human nature. Free will come to an end and fate will favor the frugal. Imagine the lesson learned the first time the electric bill comes for the first dc charge! No words can burn like a bill!
 
SparkevBlogspot said:
...As for free, there is no such thing. In case of "free" charging, all those who use DCFC pay as extra waiting that wouldn't be without "free", ...
I don't know guys....
I'm approaching 40k miles of my ownership and according to my extensive calculations it has been FREE, mostly.
(I feel sorry for my battery in the dead of winter and plug in at home overnight. That cost me $34 one winter season. :( . I need to figure out how to get the TMS without the charge... ;)

Twice I pulled into a DCFC, which I only use on weekends (if needed) and during airport runs, and found it occupied.
Once with a Tesla, so I moved on to the next one and once with a Leaf, so I moved on to the next one. Not a problem in my town.

I mostly got this +$1000 in savings, (versus buying electrons at home), at an L2 across the street from where I work.
My car ownership costs are going down daily. How can that not be a good thing?

Of course living in EV heaven helps. +1000 L2's (6.6kW) and 15 combo DCFC units!!
https://www.kcpl.com/about-kcpl/environmental-focus/clean-charge-network
 
So there's a big shopping mall near me on Long Island with six free level 2 chargers (three stations, two per station). The terms are: charge for free, but limited to two hours. Usually, most of the chargers are available, so, get a quick top-off while shopping, or watching a movie at the theater. Last weekend, I guess because it was black-cyber-sale-of-a-lifetime weekend, every charger was in use. I park two cars away from, I don't remember what kind of car, but not a Tesla or a Chevy. The car's sitting there, plugged in, not charging; the two hours of free charging have already elapsed, shut down automatically. I'm a little frustrated, but hey, I understand, you don't need to hold a vigil next to your car while it's charging, and they'd probably be back soon. I do some shopping, come back maybe an hour later, and the same car is in the spot, this time, during another active charging session that they started while I was away. OK, I guess I'm a little miffed now, but... I didn't leave a note... I didn't key their car. It turns out that when I parked two cars away, I chatted with the driver who just arrived in the single space between us. Maybe I could have swapped spaces, unplugged the offending driver and plugged in after his first charge was already completed, buuut, didn't. I'm sure the other driver didn't drive around the mall, see all the spots were filled and thought, "aha, I'm gonna hog this charger all day! hahahaaaa." I'm sure he didn't see the Spark two spaces away and either way, I wasn't by my car then. In the big scheme of things, I guess I had to spend an extra fifty cents of electricity at home that day.
 
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