SparkE
Posts: 386
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2016 1:18 am
Location: SF Bay Area (San Jose, CA)

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:40 pm

MrDRMorgan wrote:
Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:16 am
Kermit wrote:
Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:51 pm
It was interesting to see the capacity dropped even though it was not charged to 100%. We shall see what it does as it warms up.
I usually see a 0.3 to 0.4 kWh rise as we go into summer and, as we head for winter, it drops again and goes lower. The linear trendline on my graph projects I will be at 11.4 kWh when I have 60k miles on the ODO. I currently have 30k on my 2016 and my battery capacity is 14.5 kWh. I estimate my battery capacity will continue to drop to 14 kWh at 35k miles, 13 kWh at 45k miles, 12 kWh at 55k miles and 11 kWh at 65k miles. If I drop below 11.4 kWh before August 2024, I will be visiting the dealer to discuss a HV battery warranty claim.
It seems to me that you will be taking lots of longer trips in your SparkEV in 2023, to bump up the mileage ...

Might as well get a new battery in 2024!

MrDRMorgan
Posts: 1127
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
Location: Manteca in Central California

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:00 am

SparkE wrote:
Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:40 pm
MrDRMorgan wrote:
Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:16 am
Kermit wrote:
Mon Apr 20, 2020 12:51 pm
It was interesting to see the capacity dropped even though it was not charged to 100%. We shall see what it does as it warms up.
I usually see a 0.3 to 0.4 kWh rise as we go into summer and, as we head for winter, it drops again and goes lower. The linear trendline on my graph projects I will be at 11.4 kWh when I have 60k miles on the ODO. I currently have 30k on my 2016 and my battery capacity is 14.5 kWh. I estimate my battery capacity will continue to drop to 14 kWh at 35k miles, 13 kWh at 45k miles, 12 kWh at 55k miles and 11 kWh at 65k miles. If I drop below 11.4 kWh before August 2024, I will be visiting the dealer to discuss a HV battery warranty claim.
It seems to me that you will be taking lots of longer trips in your SparkEV in 2023, to bump up the mileage ...

Might as well get a new battery in 2024!
I need to add about 12k miles per year starting now to ensure the battery degradation exceeds the warranty replacement point! Even then, there is no guarantee I will get a NEW battery.

The 2016 Limited Warranty booklet states on page 14: "If warranty repair requires replacement, the high voltage battery may be replaced with either a new or factory refurbished high voltage battery with and energy capacity (kWh storage) level at or within approximately 10% of that of the original battery at the time of warranty repair."

NORTON
Posts: 1297
Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 5:52 am
Location: KC,MO

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Thu Apr 23, 2020 7:50 am

MrDRMorgan wrote:
Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:00 am
.... Even then, there is no guarantee I will get a NEW battery.

The 2016 Limited Warranty booklet states on page 14: "If warranty repair requires replacement, the high voltage battery may be replaced with either a new or factory refurbished high voltage battery with and energy capacity (kWh storage) level at or within approximately 10% of that of the original battery at the time of warranty repair."
Tricky....
"10% of that of the original battery at the time of warranty repair" That's a fine line. :?
Who will make these detailed measurements? What the margin of error in repeated battery cap testing?

Oh well, it sounds like it's not worth pursuing that dream of a 'New' battery pack.
Just drive the little BEV and see where it takes you in 5 years.
Don Worry Bout a Ting. 8-)

We are basically early adopters of this 'short range BEV', all ~7500 of us.
What about that one guy that posted here about being over 100k miles? How's he doing?
Used '14 2LT w/ DCFC. +82K miles.
Mostly free charging! Only one LONG visit to the shop....
GM needs Modern Troubleshooting tools for Modern EV's.
3 step Trouble Tree, 1st try car died again, 2nd try not covered / cost $800. 3rd try fixed the problem.

MrDRMorgan
Posts: 1127
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
Location: Manteca in Central California

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Thu Apr 23, 2020 2:50 pm

NORTON wrote:
Thu Apr 23, 2020 7:50 am
MrDRMorgan wrote:
Wed Apr 22, 2020 9:00 am
.... Even then, there is no guarantee I will get a NEW battery.

The 2016 Limited Warranty booklet states on page 14: "If warranty repair requires replacement, the high voltage battery may be replaced with either a new or factory refurbished high voltage battery with and energy capacity (kWh storage) level at or within approximately 10% of that of the original battery at the time of warranty repair."
Tricky....
"10% of that of the original battery at the time of warranty repair" That's a fine line. :?
Who will make these detailed measurements? What the margin of error in repeated battery cap testing?

Oh well, it sounds like it's not worth pursuing that dream of a 'New' battery pack.
Just drive the little BEV and see where it takes you in 5 years.
Don Worry Bout a Ting. 8-)

We are basically early adopters of this 'short range BEV', all ~7500 of us.
What about that one guy that posted here about being over 100k miles? How's he doing?
Good question! If losing 1 kWh every 10k miles is "normal", then he would have to have 9 kWh or less remaining.

Note: From June 2018 to April 2020, I measured my battery capacity 116 times and drove 19,590 miles. Over that same period of time, my battery capacity degraded 2.1 kWh - (16.6 kWh to 14.5 kWh).

Over the same interval of time, I drove my 2014 Spark EV only 8865 miles and the battery capacity also dropped 2.1 kWh (17.2 kWh to 15.1 kWh).
:o Maybe the electrons here in California are falling into a "black hole" and disappear forever!

ElDobro
Posts: 67
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:05 pm
Location: NJ

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Fri Apr 24, 2020 7:12 am

Back in January, I reported that the battery kWh was 11.5, according to Torque Pro. This last charge, I started with 53 miles on the GOM and I drove 66.3 miles, with 9 miles left on the GOM. According to the energy screen, I used 87% of the battery at 13.3 kWh. This would tell me that the battery was trending at 15.3 kWh, right?

I charged up the battery overnight at the 12 amp setting and the display showed it would take 9 1/2 hours to do it. The GOM is at 60 miles now. I checked the capacity with Torque Pro and it's still telling me the capacity is 11.5 kWh. Hmmm....

I'm going to run the GOM down to 8-9 miles again and see what happens.

MrDRMorgan
Posts: 1127
Joined: Wed Oct 30, 2013 7:27 am
Location: Manteca in Central California

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Fri Apr 24, 2020 6:44 pm

ElDobro wrote:
Fri Apr 24, 2020 7:12 am
Back in January, I reported that the battery kWh was 11.5, according to Torque Pro. This last charge, I started with 53 miles on the GOM and I drove 66.3 miles, with 9 miles left on the GOM. According to the energy screen, I used 87% of the battery at 13.3 kWh. This would tell me that the battery was trending at 15.3 kWh, right?

I charged up the battery overnight at the 12 amp setting and the display showed it would take 9 1/2 hours to do it. The GOM is at 60 miles now. I checked the capacity with Torque Pro and it's still telling me the capacity is 11.5 kWh. Hmmm....

I'm going to run the GOM down to 8-9 miles again and see what happens.
Looking at my TorquePro data, the battery capacity number does not vary with variations in the SoC number or GOM number. SoC is a the percent of the value of the battery capacity. 100% SoC would be equal to the battery capacity. GOM is affected by many driving and ambient variables.

If I may make a suggestion, it would be to fully charge your battery so the data on the information screen resets to zero. Reset your trip meter and then do your driving test. Drive in D on a flat highway, at a constant speed and for a period long enough to use up a good portion of your battery capacity. Also, make sure you total all of the percentages on the Energy Information screen - not just battery.

I think you will find Torque Pro is reasonably accurate.

ElDobro
Posts: 67
Joined: Sat Aug 31, 2019 1:05 pm
Location: NJ

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Thu Apr 30, 2020 7:25 am

As I did last time, I fully charged the car so the energy screen zeroed out and I reset the trip. I drove about 55 highway miles and the rest brought me up to 62 miles on the trip, with the GOM estimate at 15 miles left and the trip average was at 6mi/kWh. The energy screen had me using 10.5 kWh at 80% battery usage which should give me 13.2 kWh at 100%.

I let the car fully charge overnight. The GOM estimate is now starting at 70 and Torque Pro is now telling me the battery capacity estimate is 12.5 kWh, up 1 kWh from the last time I checked. I'm going to follow this pattern and see if I get any more changes.

RSC
Posts: 57
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:45 am

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Fri May 01, 2020 7:50 am

May readings:

Date.......... Miles. Capacity (kWh)
05/5/2019 18601 16.1
06/1/2019 18905 15.9
07/3/2019 19259 15.9
08/1/2019 19669 16.3
09/1/2019 19878 16.4
10/2/2019 20190 16.0
11/1/2019 20611 16.0
12/3/2019 20974 15.7
01/1/2020 21176 15.7
02/1/2020 21460 15.4
03/1/2020 21692 15.2
04/1/2020 21951 15.2
05/1/2020 22026 15.2

A total of 75 miles last month (trying to stay home). Weather a little warmer, but still no increase in capacity.
Ray
2015 Spark EV 1LT, DCFC

RSC
Posts: 57
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:45 am

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Mon Jun 01, 2020 7:00 am

June 2020 readings:

Date........ .. Miles. Capacity (kWh)
05/5/2019 18601 16.1
06/1/2019 18905 15.9
07/3/2019 19259 15.9
08/1/2019 19669 16.3
09/1/2019 19878 16.4
10/2/2019 20190 16.0
11/1/2019 20611 16.0
12/3/2019 20974 15.7
01/1/2020 21176 15.7
02/1/2020 21460 15.4
03/1/2020 21692 15.2
04/1/2020 21951 15.2
05/1/2020 22026 15.2
06/1/2020 22121 15.2
Ray
2015 Spark EV 1LT, DCFC

NORTON
Posts: 1297
Joined: Fri May 01, 2015 5:52 am
Location: KC,MO

Re: Questions and Data tracking

Sat Jun 06, 2020 4:47 am

My last set of data points:

Miles - - Date - - - - % Used - kWh Used - Present Capacity
_____________________________________________________________
72,467 10-28-19 78% -- 15.1 -- 19.36
77,023 2-14-20 48% -- 8.6 -- 17.92
77,581 3-2-20 84% -- 13.9 -- 16.55 Note: 8 miles remaining.
80,852 5-22-20 61% -- 10.6 -- 17.38
81,353 6-3-20 95% -- 16.1 -- 16.95 Note: 6 miles remaining.
________________________________________________________________

These are numbers from the energy page.
I have no idea why this pack is doing so well. :!:
I definitely flog this car, because the electrons are mostly free. ;)
Except in the winter, I charge to full once a day and it's at that state for at most 4 hrs unplugged.
Lately I've been plugging in at noon so I pick it up at the end of the work day, fully charged for < 1 hr.
In hot weather this is a better plan.
Used '14 2LT w/ DCFC. +82K miles.
Mostly free charging! Only one LONG visit to the shop....
GM needs Modern Troubleshooting tools for Modern EV's.
3 step Trouble Tree, 1st try car died again, 2nd try not covered / cost $800. 3rd try fixed the problem.

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